Juliet Wilson - how to get your chronic illness diagnosed and treated even when you look healthy

Juliet survived over a decade of relentless health issues and being told 'But you don't look sick,' by dozens of doctors and specialists, before finally coming across a doctor who recognised what she was dealing with.  

Realising that there are so many people like her around the world, not diagnosed properly and struggling for years, Juliet felt it was important to share what she had learned, in the hope of helping others regain their health, and survive the experience along the way. 

A senior project manager, photographer, artist, and author, Juliet lives with her son in Melbourne, Australia.  

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Music by Ian Hildebrand

Transcript

Arwen Bardsley: 0:00

Welcome, everyone. delighted today to have you back for another episode of the five star wellbeing podcast. And I've got my beautiful friend Juliet Wilson here as my guest today. And it's always super nice to have somebody who's a friend, as well as someone who is a very interesting person with a wonderful story and a lot of well being knowledge to share with my audience. So I'm really delighted to have Juliet here. Juliet is a senior project manager, a photographer and artist, and now an author. Juliet survived over a decade of serious and chronic health issues and being told that you don't look sick by dozens of doctors and specialists. She's now written a book titled, But You Look Healthy, which chronicles her journey. But more importantly, is a guidebook for anyone out there struggling with complex and often undiagnosed health concerns. So I think there's a ton of wealth that we can all get from this book that Juliet's written and what she's going to tell us today. So Juliet, thank you so much for making the time to come on the podcast. And I wanted to just start with a bit about you, you know, your sort of origin story and how you got to be where you are now, having written a book, on this topic, all about your health. I guess I'm sure along the way, you will tell us a bit about the health concerns that you have had. But I think that probably helps to, to make people aware of the enormity of what you've gone through.

Juliet Wilson: 1:48

Thank you, Arwen, I'm delighted to join you this morning. So as you just said, my name is Juliet. And I grew up in Eastern Canada, and also in the northeastern part of the US in Maine, which is an endemic tick area. And I came to this beautiful country 31 years ago when I was 22. And Melbourne was actually my first stop on my round the world trip. And I've lived here ever since. Yeah, so I guess the start of my health journey. Looking back in my, in my late 20s Actually, I had a tarot card reading. And a psychic told me that I was going to stop work when I was 39. Now at the time, I thought, oh, maybe she means I'm going to retire young. But I thought that was kind of unlikely, because I was looking at a career in the museum world. And so I laughed it off and I just kind of went on with my life. And then it was over a decade later, in 2008. When those words came back to me and at 39 My world collapsed and I was so ill that I had to stop work for two years while I slowly recovered from that. I never dreamed that that might have been what she was foreshadowing. So what happened was that after separating from my young son's father became very well unwell overnight. I lost five kilos, I'd crushing insomnia, digestive distress, headaches, sore throat, burning patches of skin, brain fog, exhaustion, cold sores that would come in my eyes regularly, hormone and body temperature dysregulation. I was hyper secreting cortisol. And that was just the start of what ended up being a very long, 12 years. When I look back, there were signs that I had a compromised immune system much earlier in my life. It took me nearly a year to recover from glandular fever as a teenager, and I've always needed more sleep than anyone else. I've always caught every virus and bacterial infection that came anywhere near me and have been worse than anyone else. I've always been told by my doctors and practitioners that I've that I had the worst reaction they'd ever seen to treatments. And what I now know is that contracting Lyme disease at a young age had actually impaired my immune system and over time had left me unequipped to fight anything else off. So I kind of got better after that first two years, but it was still, you know, quite a journey and things weren't quite right. And over the next 10 years, I was diagnosed with a variety of other things. First adrenal fatigue, then heavy metal toxicity SIBO. And finally, mold illness. I treated each one of those, but never seem to regain my full health and I had the instinct that there was still something that was undiagnosed.

Arwen Bardsley: 4:25

And I think that a lot of people like especially in Australia, I know I've had people say to me, oh, you know, Lyme disease isn't a thing in Australia. But of course, there's lots of people who come from other places where perhaps ticks are more prevalent and that sort of thing, but I think it's probably useful to talk a bit about Lyme in terms of, you know, a 101 basics for people who haven't heard of it, or you know, don't don't understand that. Yes, people in Australia may indeed suffer from This terrible illness.

Juliet Wilson: 5:02

Absolutely. And, you know, it's a common story that it takes. You know, my story is not unique, it generally takes over a decade to get a diagnosis of Lyme in Australia. You know, the getting the diagnosis is very challenging in other parts of the world. Authorities recognize that testing can be unreliable and recommend that Lyme disease is actually a clinical diagnosis based on the patient's symptoms, history, tick exposure risks and risk and current symptoms. Current research actually shows that they estimate 15% of the world's population have been exposed to Lyme bacteria.

Arwen Bardsley: 5:42

That's massive.

Juliet Wilson: 5:46

Our government's stance here is that people cannot contract classical Lyme disease, and it's common co infections. Because despite the number of Australians becoming chronically ill after tick bite, there's a belief that the bacteria that causes Lyme disease doesn't exist in Australia. Now, this is based on research from 1994, that did not find Borrelia burgdorferi, which is the bacteria that causes Lyme disease in Australian ticks. However, studies be done before that, and after that actually found Borrelia species and ticks removed from Australian fauna, domestic animals and cattle. So there's plenty of proof that Lyme disease does actually exist here. However, you know, in Australia, the guidelines of the state that a lab test is essential for diagnosis, but you can only be tested if you've traveled overseas to a Lyme endemic country because the government says it doesn't exist here. And the tests that are currently available in Australia are not definitive, they're not sensitive enough. It's also because it can take weeks for the bacteria to actually show up in lab tests. And tests are just not always accurate, because with a compromised immune system, many patients don't actually make the antibodies to alarm infection, so they won't show up. So this means that many Australians have to work with Lyme literate practitioners in other countries, through online consultations or through going overseas to clinics for treatment at really prohibitive cost to get diagnosis and treatment. So that was why for me finding an effective comprehensive protocol that I could order online within Australia was really a game changer for me. And, you know, I felt that it was really important because as I said, My My experiences are not unique, complex, long term illness is extremely common, and millions of people have been unwell for years and unable to find answers. Without reliable tests, they're often diagnosed with chronic fatigue or IBS or fibromyalgia. But it's now known that if you suffer from any of those conditions or illnesses, others such as adrenal dysfunction, heavy metal toxicity, biotoxin illness or Lyme disease, there's a good chance you will actually have a whole suite of them. And that's because of the way their opportunistic nature, when your immune system is really low, and the synergistic way they work together. And because so many of those illnesses have common symptoms. It's easy for some of them to go undiagnosed for a very long time. But it's actually the world leading Lyme disease doctor, Dr. Richard Horowitz, who has given a name to this suite of illnesses. And he calls it MSIDS or multiple systemic infectious diseases syndrome. The great news is that it is common, it's treatable, and you can recover. And my book actually tells people how I did that. And much more than just a personal journey of my experiences. "But you look healthy" is actually the product of 12 years of research I did along the way into each one of these illnesses. And I'm a bit of a nerd. So I researched incessantly. And each section of the book provides really helpful practical, easily digestible information and resources for each of the illnesses it covers, as well as the common pitfalls to avoid during treatment, because I fell into absolutely all of them. And I was just rapt when Dr. Richard Horwitz, read my manuscript when I sent it to him. And not only gave me great feedback, but offered to write an introduction for as well. And he has dedicated his life to helping and advocating for those with Lyme disease. And his support for my book and endorsement of its content is really a dream come true for me.

Arwen Bardsley: 9:21

yeah. It's amazing. And so for you, you didn't get a diagnosis in Australia, though, didn't you?

Juliet Wilson: 9:29

I did, but I had to. I saw a local doctor but had to do testing that was sent overseas, right. So my tests, you know, officially conducted by highly reputable international labs whose results are taken seriously in the rest of the world. My results would not be considered official by the infectious diseases doctors here in Australia.

Arwen Bardsley: 9:55

Right. And so is it called the Lyme disease association of Australia who I know are getting $1 from each of the book, sales that that you have with your book, are they advocating and lobbying the government to to change, and you know perhaps do some more up to date research rather than, you know, relying on this research from the 1990s? On the ticks...

Juliet Wilson: 10:25

Yep. And their website is a wonderful resource of a lot of information. They work tirelessly trying to advocate and support people with Lyme disease in Australia, and there are 1000s and 1000s of us. So their work is extremely important and not well supported enough. So I felt it was really important to share some of the proceeds of this book to support the work that they do. And in fact, Dr. Richard Horowitz is a patron of the Lyme Disease Association of Australia. He also recognizes the value of the work that they do, and they really value the support that he provides in that arena.

Arwen Bardsley: 11:01

And so, is there any estimate on you know, numbers of people who might have the disease in Australia, but don't haven't had a diagnosis and aren't aware that that's something they could be treating?

Juliet Wilson: 11:17

Look, as I said, you know, they estimate 15% of the population

Arwen Bardsley: 11:22

That's worldwide.

Juliet Wilson: 11:23

Yeah, yeah, worldwide. Now, there are no, there are no borders or walls that stop ticks from, from, you know, and other vectors that carry tick borne illnesses or other illnesses and infections, there's, there are no borders or walls that stop those from, you know, from traveling to all parts of the world, this idea that there can be one part of a country that doesn't have ticks when the rest of the country does is, is just ridiculous, even, you know, some people believe that there can be one part of a city that wouldn't have. But the rest does.

Arwen Bardsley: 11:57

Yeah. And so even if you can't remember being exposed to ticks, but the illness could be carried on another animal that might have the illness or do you have to have been exposed to a tick?

Juliet Wilson: 12:12

No, there are definitely other vectors or blood sucking, You know, vectors that that carry infections. And in the, in my book, there is a comprehensive chapter all about Lyme disease, which lists everything from you know what it is, let me just look up everything that's in the section. Here we go. So what is Lyme disease? Why is it controversial? What are the symptoms? How do I know if I have it? Why is Lyme disease hard to treat? What can I expect when I start treatment, as well as helpful resources? Now, Dr. Richard Horowitz has actually put together a lyme questionnaire with questions that if you, you do the questionnaire and you get above a certain score, it's a strong indication that you have a tick borne illness. Now that questionnaire has actually been scientifically validated. So that is what's used in other parts of the world to do alongside the clinical diagnosis and is very, very accurate.

Arwen Bardsley: 13:25

So people could do that for themselves.

Juliet Wilson: 13:28

That's right. And if they, if they then would would like a, you know, a more formal confirmation of that there are things that they can do. But as I mentioned, you know, even doing the highly reputable, very expensive tests from overseas, that may satisfy their own curiosity about whether they have a tick borne illness, but that will still not be accepted by the mainstream medical community in Australia.

Arwen Bardsley: 13:53

Yeah. Okay. So I wanted to talk about some other things that you've experienced as well, because all of them, you know, the adrenal dysfunction, the heavy metal stuff, the SIBO, biotoxin illness, they're all things as well, that I think, number one, a lot of people aren't really aware that those things could be affecting their health. And number two, you know, people people don't know, you know, even what they are sometimes or what to do about them. And your book is an absolutely amazing resource for for all of those things, as well as the Lyme disease section. I wanted to start with the adrenal dysfunction or adrenal fatigue. Some people may be more aware of that kind of term. But again, it's something that's a bit controversial in the medical world, but I really loved reading in your book, your explanation about the underlying cause of that being mitchondrial dysfunction. So that is the power, the power house of our cells is not functioning correctly. Which, you know, I guess anybody who understands that knows that that is really major thing to have go wrong. Can you talk a bit more about that? And I suppose also just, again, for people who maybe aren't aware of adrenal dysfunction, you know, what were you experiencing with that? What should people look out for?

Juliet Wilson: 15:31

Yeah, that's a really good question, Arwen. And you know, the thing, the thing about adrenal dysfunction and the fact that the mitochondria are not functioning as well as they can, you know, you can certainly take a lot of things that will help your adrenal function that will, you know, and that's what I did at the time. You know, when I, as I said, the symptoms came on overnight, you know, I was, weight just melted off me, my hair was falling out, I had crushing exhaustion, but I could not sleep and I had these heart palpitations that were waking me up at 4am Every day, and my hormone levels just plummeted at 39. I almost went into menopause, everything I ate just hurt my digestive system. Yeah, and, you know, that was back in 2008. And adrenal fatigue as a term was not very well known then. And of course, the first doctor I saw, you know, tried to tell me that it was just depression, not that, you know, depression is a is something not to take, seriously. But, you know, her solution was to put me on Prozac, which I had a terrible reaction to and didn't change any of the symptoms and didn't work for me. So sorry, remind me what your question was, again.

Arwen Bardsley: 16:50

So I mean, so you've talked about what you experienced with it. So just about, I guess a bit more about the mitochondrial dysfunction, what's going on, in the body, in somebody with this condition.

Juliet Wilson: 17:03

So often, really, adrenal dysfunction is when your adrenal glands and your hypothalamus pituitary axis become depleted or dysregulated, after a period of intense or prolonged stress, or chronic illness. And so generally, you can feel unwell exhausted, your immune system is low, you have sleep disturbances. And in the more serious cases you're functioning can have the adrenals can be so diminished, that you can barely get out of bed for you know, short periods of time each day. Now, it's interesting, so many years later to realize that what I did at the time to nourish my adrenal function itself, and to help me sleep, and all of those were wonderful band aid solutions, but you've always got to look for what is the underlying cause of the adrenal dysfunction. It wasn't just the stress the underlying causes. For me, as I found out over the years that passed since then, were higher than normal levels of heavy metals, mold toxicity, you know, all of those other things that affect your immune system and affect your body's ability to cope with the day to day functions and to actually detox properly. So really, you know, again, it, I'll come back to the fact that there's, you know, what I see and hear from so many people is, you know, and the same for me, I treated my adrenal dysfunction for two years. And then I kind of kept going, and then oh, it was heavy metals, right? Okay. Well, if I treat that I'll be good. And oh, sorry, it's actually mold illness, okay. Well, if I treat that I'll be good. But unless you're actually treating all of them completely, you won't regain your health and Dr. Horowitz in his book, "Why can't I get better", summed it up perfectly, when he said, It's like going to the doctor with 16 nails in your hand, and you only remove two of them, you will still be in pain. So it's very important that along with you know, and in the book, I give you lots of tips and, and resources for actually rebuilding your, your adrenals and for coping with the adrenal dysfunction and how to nourish them. But it's really important that you actually get to the, to the root cause of why your adrenals are not functioning as well as they could.

Arwen Bardsley: 19:14

Yeah, yeah. Great. And yeah, I mean, I love that you said that, because I mean, that's what I'm always talking about, you know, it's kind of it's looking number one at the underlying the root cause of what's going on. And number two, it, you know, the whole, the whole body, the whole system, you know, and it's not just the physical system as well, you know, I know, you talk about trauma in the book as well, which is, you know, an underlying cause of so many things that people deal with. And, you know, you Yeah, the mental state as well. I mean, you know, I just, we have to see ourselves as a whole system of all of these things on all of these levels and treat that one Being in order to be well, so heavy, heavy metal toxicity is another thing that again, I think, let me show your book while I've got it here, because I just wanted to, you know, I was amazed with the heavy metal toxicity. Symptoms, you know, the list is literally more than half a page fatigue, dizziness, headaches, digestion issues, joint and muscle pain, anxiety and depression, irregular menstrual cycles, infertility, well, it goes on and on night sweats, I shouldn't say blah, blah, blah, because it's not blah, blah, blah, it's but you know, there's all these things that I think again, you know, a lot of people may have some of these symptoms. So my question is really, you know, when should someone consider being tested for heavy metals? Because, again, it's something that most doctors won't think about, especially, you know, just your your standard GP, would probably not even consider testing you for that unless perhaps you worked in an industry where it was fairly obvious that that might be a problem. So when do you think you know, the average person who might have a few of those symptoms and hasn't been able to get to the bottom of why they just don't feel well? What's your advice on when they should consider being tested for heavy metals?

Juliet Wilson: 21:28

Yeah, look, that's a really good question, Arwen, and you know, what a lot of people don't realize is that we are exposed to heavy metals every single day in the air, the food, the water through the ground, the things we use, consume, that we're exposed to everyday, like anti-perspirants, aluminium foil cans, and cookware, your tap water, your dental fillings, tobacco, smoke, rice, air pollution, auto exhaust, batteries, vaccines, over time, heavy metals can accumulate in your tissues without you even realizing that it's happening. And as you said, you know, most doctors are trained to look at a set of symptoms and make one diagnosis. And so when people like come in with, as you said, this list of 77 different symptoms, their first reaction is, I think you're making some of this up, I think you're exaggerating. And that is a common common story for all of us with this kind of chronic illness, particularly with this suite of illnesses. Now, of course, one of the things that makes it challenging is the things that are very common for people to suffer from, such as Lyme disease, parasites, heavy metals, mold illness, they can be hard to test for. Now, part of the issue with heavy metals is, the reason people will become unwell is because they aren't detoxing or excreting them, well, they're not clearing them from the, from your body, from their body. And the testing methods are usually about what is coming out of your body and your urine, your blood, you know, et cetera. And so the people that are most sick, the levels will not show in those testing methods. So it is it is very, very challenging, and also very, very common that heavy metals are affecting people. Now, the other reasons that testing is challenging is because the metals often are buried really deep in your fat cells and your liver and your kidneys, etc. And sometimes they'll only actually be revealed when you've been on a detox program for an extended period of time. What a lot of people understand as they start, what usually is a is a journey, it's, it's, it's not a sprint, it's a marathon. And you do have to detox very slowly to make sure that your body can cope with the speed at which the toxins are moving through. So we always say that, you know, as you detox, it's like peeling back the layers of an onion. And sometimes you will experience an increase in symptoms as you peel back another layer. The other thing is that toxic metals, you know, are only on for instance, in your blood in high concentrations for a short period of time after an acute exposure. So most of us accumulate our heavy metals to small exposures over a period of time. So in different metals are excreted in different ways. So one type of testing may miss metals and another type of testing would pick up. So I always suggest that, you know, find a good integrative doctor who is familiar with heavy metals, talk to them about what their preferred method of testing is. What I love about the comprehensive detox protocol I did is that it there's not really a need to identify exactly which metals you have higher than normal concentrations of exactly which mycotoxins exactly which viruses you're trying to get rid of. The protocol is actually comprehensive In that, if you systematically move through the whole thing, you will accomplish everything that you need to. But the important thing to understand about the Cellcore Biosciences comprehensive protocol, which is what I use to treat all of this suite of illnesses that I had, is that it's not just the products that you take, it's actually the approach and order in which you take them, which really is one of the keys to the success of your full recovery.

Arwen Bardsley: 25:33

I would like you to tell us about that protocol. But just before we do that, yeah, I had. So I've done some heavy metal testing myself with my naturopath over nearly a year now. Or no, not quite nine months, so So I've just done the third one. And so hair analysis is how he's been doing it. And it wasn't until so the first one came back. And I can't even remember, there wasn't anything that was super high. There was there was one that was coming up as a low level, and it's just escaping me what it was. But anyway, it wasn't until the second test. So of course, in the meantime, over that would have been more than three months, between, you know, from when I first started detoxing, just what you're saying using binders using glutathione, to detox from anything that was in my system that was impairing my adrenal function. Then when I did the second test, then I had these really high levels of cadmium that came out. So it was just so interesting to me that in first test that didn't come out, but it wasn't until I've started peeling back some of the layers that started to show.

Juliet Wilson: 26:52

Yeah, that's very common, and often really freaks people out. Because they think, Oh, my gosh, is not working. Why are the levels going up? But then it's very common that the levels go up before they come down again.

Arwen Bardsley: 27:05

Yeah, yeah. It was fascinating. So yeah. As you've brought it up, and I know it's been a such an important part of your, your recovery process, and will be so useful to so many people. Can you talk us through the protocol that you discovered, and perhaps even how you discovered it? And what involves Yeah,

Juliet Wilson: 27:26

yeah. And look, there are lots of successful protocols that people can use. This just happens to be the one that that I chose, and I'll, I'll help you understand why. So when I was first diagnosed with Lyme disease, which was, gosh, over two years ago, now, the timing was very close to when the international Lyme summit online was was happening. So I thought, right, I need, you know, in my usual way, I like to do lots of research, find out everything about what I'm dealing with. So I listened to all 35 hours of experts from around the world talking about Lyme disease, treatments, etc, etc. And it was really the talk by two doctors from the US Dr. Jay Davidson and Dr. Todd watts, that when I heard them speak about their experiences, their protocol and why and how they developed it, I just instinctively knew that it made sense everything they were saying made sense. Now, Dr. Todd Watts had recovered fully himself from Lyme disease and all of the CO infections that go with it. Dr. J. Davidson, his wife had been very unwell since she was she was a child with Lyme disease and CO infections, and she had almost died a couple of times. And she fully recovered on this protocol that they developed. So they felt it was really important to share their knowledge with the world and you know, and they, they created two companies Microbe formulas, which is sort of the public general public company and Cell Corp biosciences, which is more of the one that practitioners use, the products are the same, they have different names. It's a little confusing. But first of all, all the products are fully herbal, very, very high quality, and they're formulated for really sensitive people. Now all of us with Lyme disease higher than normal, heavy metals, etc. Our systems are sensitive because we don't detox well and we've got higher than normal levels of lots of things. They're making our system not work the way it should. So we often need to start in very low doses. And I love that Cellcore Biosciences protocol because they provide such straightforward information. Okay, for phase one, you take these four products, you start on this dose for sensitive dosing, you want to get it up to this dose for aggressive dosing. And it's just depends on how your body deals with it, how you build up those doses, but it was also when I listened to them talk about the fact that the reason their protocol was so successful wasn't just because the products are really well developed, they're very high quality. And they're formulated for people's bodies like ours that need, you know, that are often quite sensitive. It was the approach and the order that you do things in. So first of all, you need to make sure that your body can eliminate the toxins that you want to detox or the pathogens that you kill off. Because if your pathways that you use to eliminate them are not working well, you can get these backups. And you can get fatigue, joint pain, brain fog, you know, as it makes, it actually makes your body more toxic. So the first thing that you do in this protocol is support your drainage pathways and make sure that they're open, which means you know, your bowels, your liver, your kidneys, your lymph system and your skin, making sure that all your elimination pathways are really working well before you then start detoxing and killing things off. Because of the you know, the the things that are then released into your system when you do that. So then it's really important that your body has the energy to carry out the functions of detoxification, and to signal to your immune system to fight off any of the infections that you have, and also to stimulate the death of damaged cells. So you know, underlying issues like as I said before, like viruses, parasites, heavy metals, medications, oxidative stress, those damage your mitochondria, and can cause dysfunction, this can lead to that sort of low energy, the buildup of toxins that decline in your immune system, and really impair the ability of your cells to repair. So if you support your mitochondrial energy, it will improve your energy help promote the healing, and also help maintain your lasting health. So there are products that you take that support your cellular energy to help with a detox that improve the oxygen levels in your tissues, which is important for the respiration of yourselves and for healing. And then trace minerals and amino acids that again, support detox through giving your body what it needs for energy while you do that,

Unknown: 32:17

then it's actually an another really critical part of all of this is, you know, if you're killing and removing things, you really want to be binding up the byproducts of what you're killing and removing or, you know, binding up the toxins themselves. Instead of, you know, there are a lot of things that people take as binders that are actually not holding those toxins for long enough. And it's just redistributing the toxins in different parts of your body. So the binders that they use with the Cellcore Biosciences protocol, are actually fulvic and humic. Based, these are the latest and greatest in binders. They are very effective and binding everything from mold, mycotoxins, herbicides, pesticides, mold, heavy metals, chemicals, radioactive elements. And even, you know even better than that, you can actually take them with food, they don't strip your microbiome, like some of the older types of binders, like activated charcoal, those sort of things, they'll actually nourish your microbiome rather than strip it, they're safe to take long term, and they have high energy, carbon and oxygen that your your cells really need. You can take more than one binder at a time, depending on what things you're targeting. And, you know, like with all supplements that you take, you know, to, when you embark on a detox journey, it's really important just to start really low and slow, and build up your tolerance, what people find is that the things that they really need to most address are the things that they will have the most reactions to when they start treating if they start on on doses that are too high. So yeah, so those are the things that are really, really important to make sure that your elimination pathways are open, that you're supporting your body's energy to deal with the detox and that you're actually binding up all of the unwanted things as you're removing them and killing them off.

Arwen Bardsley: 34:16

Oh, wonderful. Sorry, did you sorry, did I interrupt you?

Juliet Wilson: 34:22

No, I was just gonna say those are, you know, those mean that your your detox will be much more successful, and you will regain your health more successfully as well.

Arwen Bardsley: 34:34

And I know it's in your book, but just for people listening, what's the website that they can go to for more information about that?

Juliet Wilson: 34:43

Yeah, look, there are actually two really great resources, microbe formulas, which is the original. They used to have both a foundational protocol which is just kind of for tune up and a comprehensive protocol. They now only do the comprehensive protocol through Cellcore Biosciences. But the microbe formulas website has a wonderful Learn section on it. And you can join for free, join the website for free, then you could search the Learn section for hundreds of articles and videos under any topic that you want to look up. So it's really easy. Like if you type in mold, you'll come up with a list of wonderful articles, videos, they do a live webinar each week, they have those that you can can listen to as well, that's a really great resource. They also support the people that are using their protocol around the world with a Facebook group called the Microbe Formulas detox heroes. And that, again, is an amazing resource where you can, you know, search on your topic, and you can find all of the different questions other people have asked about the same type of topic, what all the answers are, it's a really wonderful, supportive community, with a lot of people with a huge amount of knowledge that they share as they go through the protocol. And it's a great way of, you know, if you're about to start a new phase, and you've got some questions, or you're experiencing a strange side effect, or you just want to know, has anyone had success with this or that it's a really terrific resource. And then the Cell Core Biosciences website is the sister company. And that's where you can order the comprehensive protocol from there actually is a supplier in Brisbane now. Who you can order the products directly from which is very, very helpful.

Arwen Bardsley: 36:30

Yeah, because you were having to order them from overseas, weren't you?

Juliet Wilson: 36:34

That's correct.

Arwen Bardsley: 36:34

Yeah, yeah. Okay. So but but members of the public can go to this Cellcore Biosciences website as well. It's not just for practitioners yep.

Juliet Wilson: 36:44

That's right.

Arwen Bardsley: 36:45

Yeah. Okay. All right, great. So you did mention, I know, you've mentioned all these things, but parasites as well. I mean, I love that quote, In your book, if you have a pulse, you have parasites, which I'm sure makes some people go, Oh, my goodness. So again, you know, when do you think, you know, people out there need to be concerned about parasites? At what point do you think they should again, be going to an integrative practitioner, and saying, I want to be tested for these things?

Juliet Wilson: 37:22

Yeah, look, and again, unfortunately, parasites are something that are difficult to test for, for a number of reasons. You know, first of all, 75% of them are, you can't see them with the naked eye. They're, they're tiny, yet they can, you know, inhabit every part of your body. Now, you know, I'll never forget when my doctor first asked me, you know, when I went in with horrendous new symptoms, you know, sorry, I got mixed up, I was just about to talk about mold. Anyway, with with parasites. One of the other reasons that they're difficult to test for is that unless your stool test is at the lab, within 15 minutes, they have a self dissolving enzyme. So by the time your sample gets to the lab, there is no evidence that they were actually there.

Arwen Bardsley: 38:16

Wow. That just doesn't happen, does it?

Juliet Wilson: 38:20

Yeah, so testing is tricky. So they often go undetected, they may not actually come out in all of your bowel movements. And, you know, there are 1000s of different types of parasites, but tests, only check for some of the common ones. So getting tested can often be a waste of time. Now, we, you know, despite what I thought at first was that parasites were only found in developing countries or in unhygenic conditions, they are extremely common. And again, we are exposed to them every day in our water, our food, our environment, our pets, you know, we walk barefoot on the ground. So they easily enter our bodies, and it's when your immune system is in, is not working as well as it could that they then, you know, go woohoo, here's a nice place for me to live. And the thing about parasites is that they, you know, they're living off you. So their job is to take all of your nourishment to nourish themselves, but not to make you so unwell that they can't survive. So they'll just you know, one of the the early signs of parasites is low iron, which is very, very common. The other thing that is often a telltale sign of parasites is that they replicate at the full moon so people often have symptoms that are more pronounced around the full moon and the new moon for instance. So there are things that yeah, just things like that. Like if your symptoms are more pronounced around the full moon that's a pretty strong sign that you've got parasites Yep, And, you know, it was Dr. Todd Watts who said, you know, if you've got a pulse, you've got parasites, and he's known, you know, in some circles as the parasite guy. And there's a huge amount of really great information, again, on the microbe formulas website in the Learn section about parasites. Now, parasites are often something that is overlooked when people are treating chronic illness. And the fact is that in order to fully recover from chronic illness, you need to start by clearing the parasites because of the way that your immune system can't clear other things while it's being affected by parasites. So when I said before that the order and approach is important, this is part of the order, where after you open your drainage pathways, and you help your body have the energy for the treatment that you're going to undergo, one of the first things you actually need to do is, is treat the parasites first, because that will then make it easier to clear the other infections. And yeah, as you clear the parasites from your body, what people find is that often lots of different symptoms and health issues actually resolve. But the important thing to remember is that, you know, it's like taking out the trash, even when you feel the issues resolved. You You Do you know, I will continue to have a maintenance protocol for parasites for the rest of my life. Yeah. So

Arwen Bardsley: 41:27

And is that because we're constantly exposed to them, so you can't really just yet it's not set and forget. Yeah,

Juliet Wilson: 41:34

that's right. And knowing that my immune system has been compromised for a very long time, and that I don't detox as well as other people because of genetic variations. It's just important that I understand what things would be helpful to do on, you know, on a regular basis for maintenance as I continue to progress through the rest of my life.

Arwen Bardsley: 41:55

Yeah. And sorry, go on,

Juliet Wilson: 41:59

again, with any of the things that you're treating, when you treat production of parasites, to avoid those severe die off reactions, because when you kill parasites, it then releases often other things, viruses, heavy metals, etc, that are being housed in the parasites. So again, preparing your elimination pathways supporting your immune system and your mitochondrial function. So your body can deal with the mobilized toxins that are being released and help rebuild your tissues and your your immune system. And using the binders to absorb and remove the toxins as you're, you're going through that treatment is really important.

Arwen Bardsley: 42:36

And the other thing, you started to talk about mold before, I did want to talk about that again, because you know, as you and I know, almost a quarter of the population has a gene, which means that they can't deal with my mold exposure really, very well, they will become very ill when they're exposed to mold. And that's huge. And then that What is it 30%, or something of buildings in the world have had water damage at some point. So again, I just would like to get a little bit from you on that on, you know, what you experienced with that, you know, what people should be aware of to look out for?

Juliet Wilson: 43:20

Yeah, absolutely. And again, I find that mold is often that thing that people overlook, as, but it's one of the most important keys in regaining your health when you've got this suite of illnesses. And so what happened for me was, after I'd been treating the heavy metals for a while, I moved with my son to an apartment near the beach. And I was doing some aggressive, heavy metal detox at the time, and started to have really extreme symptoms two weeks after we moved into this new home. Now I thought that I was having reactions to the heavy metal treatment. So I went to a new integrative doctor who specialized in heavy metals. And I explained, you know, the history of what I've been experiencing, and that, you know, my symptoms had just gotten so much worse, and I wasn't sure why but I thought maybe it was the heavy metal treatment. And he listened for a while and he said, You know, I'm not convinced this is the heavy metal treatment. He said, Have you been exposed to mold? And I thought What an odd question, you know, I'm an outdoorsy nature loving kinda girl. Molds not dangerous. It's just a fungus isn't it?! Little did I know and that was the start of a very long education into the fact that mold is not just a plant or a fungus. It is actually, you know, extremely bad for people like me who can't detox mycotoxins very well. And and as you said, you know, At 25% of people in the world have a gene variation that mean they cannot detox the mycotoxins from mold. And the figure on the water damage buildings is actually closer to 50%.

Arwen Bardsley: 45:12

Oh, wow.

Juliet Wilson: 45:14

Yeah, that have had water damage at some point. Now, you know, as I started opening my eyes, you know, I learned a lot that mold doesn't have to be visible to cause harm, that you won't often won't get well, in the same environment you got sick in you often. Often even remediating a place completely is very difficult and very expensive. You really need to reduce your exposure to biotoxins. But the good news is you can get well, it's it's a slow road, but it is absolutely possible. And part of that is also treating the other things that are affecting the immune system. But mold is, it's really important to treat mould because of the way that it normally affects your immune system, but your detox pathways, so if you're not detoxing your mycotoxins and your detox pathways are getting jammed up with with mold exposure, that's also when your heavy metal levels are going to start stacking up when your other pathogens, chemicals, you know, pesticides, etc, those levels are going to be also building up in your system, because the mold is stopping your body from detoxing Well, now, part of the problem in Australia is that a lot of areas we live in are high humidity, our buildings aren't, you know, often aren't ventilated very well. A lot of the modern architecture, for instance, the home that we've moved into was a modern apartment building near the beach. But the windows, the bathrooms have no windows. So, you know, it was it was very easy for the mould to, you know, take hold and, and grow rapidly, you know, in in the last few months, knowing the amount of flooding and heavy rains that are going on in parts of our country and the humidity. And, you know, it's wonderful to see for the first time that mold illness is being talked about in mainstream media. Because you know, even a couple of years ago, people just had never even heard of it. So it's it's good to see the awareness is growing. But I feel it is a massive issue here that is still really not understood very well not often recognized. And you know, so many people are living in moldy rental apartments with real estates agents, and landlords who are not doing the right thing, partially because they just don't understand the seriousness of it. So it is a massive problem that I would like to see a lot more information about. And yeah, it's it's the longest chapter in my book it goes into great detail about what mold illness is. It is a biotoxin illness, which is also known as chronic inflammatory response syndrome. And it causes severe inflammation and you know, this cascade of other health effects. biotoxins can be produced by lots of different things such as mold and bacteria, but also Lyme disease is a biotoxin illness. You know, so many people will really become ill when they're exposed to high levels of bio toxins. And when they're removed from that exposure, a lot of them can recover through their body's detox mechanisms. But for those 25% of us, we actually need specific binders that will help remove those from our body. And, and yeah, another, you know, fact that that, I guess, you know, kind of stopped me in my tracks was that it only takes 48 hours for the dampness from a minor leak, or a water intrusion for mold, mold fragments, bacteria and mold byproducts to start developing 48 hours. And it thrives in those moist humid places, like warm dark places like under refrigerators and inside your washing machine, you know feeds on wood and paper and organic materials and and yeah, like I said it grows in those high humidity environments as little as 48 hours. And it never grows alone. Bacteria always present as well and they also release more toxins and inflammatories that work together to make you very unwell. So you have to approach it in a number of ways you need to safely remove the source of the mold and detox your body as well as removing the other sources of toxicity in your in your home and your workplace and the other places that you spend time. You know, and I know that for most people, learning that mold exposures affecting their health can be quite overwhelming. You know, understanding the you know that there are so many different things that you need to do to remediate your living environment and help regain Your health, but it's just you know, taking one step at a time, you know, and the book really talks you through in a really deep digestible and simple way, all of those things that you need to do to remove the mold toxins from your body and to make sure that your environment is not further contributing to your health issues.

Arwen Bardsley: 50:20

And, it also, what I love was the list of things that you can do like on a monthly maintenance schedule to make sure that mold isn't building up like, you know, the putting the, the bicarb and vinegar down your drains, you know, once once a month down your bathroom drain and that sort of thing, which is, you know, just a great tip for anyone, regardless of if they've got no symptoms, or you know, that they don't have that that unfortunate gene defect if we want to put it that way. So yeah, it is what it is. And it's so easy to read everyone and really, really just available for for anyone, it's not, you know, full of sciency language that the general person on the street won't understand. So I think it's wonderful in that way. Before we finish up Juliet, I did really just want to touch on trauma, because again, in my work, you know, looking at what the underlying causes are of somebody's condition, it often does come back to emotional or even spiritual things that, you know, have not been processed effectively. So therefore, they get processed by the physical body. And I'd love for you to just talk for a couple of minutes about what you discovered about trauma and the impact that that's had for you.

Juliet Wilson: 51:48

Absolutely. And Arwen, you know, I had been hearing for many, many years through my journey, that trauma is often an underlying factor in chronic illness. You know, and when you have a serious condition like Lyme, you know, not getting rid of those unaddressed traumas or clusters of minor traumas, they don't have to be major traumas they can be, you know, clusters of minor traumas that will get in the way of your full healing. You know, and I had always looked back on my childhood and thought, Oh, well, that doesn't apply to me, you know, I had loving parents, a positive and loving environment. But I read a book that stopped me in my tracks, called the primal wound. Now, I was adopted at three weeks old and raised in Canada by a lovely, my adoptive parents are beautiful people, and you know, a very loving family in a beautiful environment. But what I guess I hadn't fully realized is that, that day that I was born, and removed from my biological mother, who was only 16, at the time, even though I can't remember that it was a trauma that was leaving deep within my body and affecting my ability to, to fully, you know, regain my health. When I read that book, it just resonated so deeply. And I finally understood that I had experienced major trauma. And the you know, I had all the hallmarks of that, and its impact on my physical health. And, you know, she explained in the book, how early trauma can impair the regulation of your hypothalamus, hypothalamus, pituitary axis. And, you know, because my life began with a trauma that I perceived to be life threatening, my cortisol and adrenaline levels would have just spiked up and my serotonin would have dropped. And that has been my pattern through my life, I naturally produce high levels of cortisol. And I'm really great in a crisis, I handle stress very, very well, you know, I appear and feel quite calm during the process. But after that, the stress passes is when I get the physical effects. And, you know, I don't I don't blame anyone for my adoption, I don't see myself as a victim. And, you know, for me, love is what makes your family and I had that in abundance. But now I finally understood that there had been an impact and that I needed to change those physical patterns and those subconscious belief systems that I had developed, so I could fully recover my health. Now, I had tried various ways of doing that, but I didn't really successfully deal with it until very recently, when I discovered something that has been an absolutely transformational experience for me. So in the book, so I had actually almost finished writing the book, and was well into my treatment protocol and having amazing success when I was diagnosed with breast cancer 18 months ago. And unfortunately, that was, you know, a side step I had to take in my in recovering my health, which was lengthy and very intense, and going through, you know, full cancer treatment of chemo, double mastectomy and radiation therapy during a full lockdown meant that I didn't have the kind of normal supports people do during cancer treatment. So I came through it and my husband was stuck in Canada at the time, the Australian Government would not grant an exemption, despite the fact he was fully vaccinated. So that he could come and support me through that. So I got through it. And, you know, sort of, at the end of last year thought, hey, you know, gosh, I'm doing really well, despite everything that happened. And, you know, my husband was able to come for a couple of months before he had to return to Canada. And just before he left was when the trauma hit, you know, when I had gotten through it, I'd coped really well. And then I was in that safe place where I could let let my guard down. And I started experiencing pretty severe PTSD. And you know, with the those same symptoms, the dramatic weight loss, the digestive distress, the crushing, insomnia, just hardly able to even go to sleep, you know, for an hour in those first few weeks. So fortunately, I had a consultation with a doctor in the US who has been guiding, you know, the last stages of my Lyme protocol. And he quickly recognized that I was experiencing post traumatic stress. And he said that I needed to look into whether I could get some Neurofeedback in Australia. He said, it's something they commonly use with their lyme patients and cancer patients. It's a wonderful tool that helps people in so many different ways. So Neurofeedback was actually developed by clinical psychologists, and it's a computer aided training method for your brain that tracks your brain's electrical activity, millisecond by millisecond, and uses your natural feedback system to give your brain feedback that enables it to self adjust and reset its own patterns. So you're not inputting anything into the brain, you're using a software system, you're attaching sensors to your ears and to your scalp, that's measuring your brain's electrical activity, and picking up when those that activity is not balanced in the way it should. And it's signaling to your brain, okay, you need to self adjust and reset your patterns. And over a series of sessions, it helps with so many different things. It's, it's been absolutely transformational for me. And, you know, I went into it thinking, you know, I'd really love it if this could improve my insomnia, but so many other things have come out of it. My body temperature is regulated for the first time in many, many years, my digestion has improved, my constipation has gone away, I'm going to sleep quicker, sleeping more deeply and waking less times in the night than I used to. There are so many things that our brain and nervous system govern in our bodies, that when they are not functioning well or out of balance, we can really suffer. And so neurofeedback is an incredibly powerful way of getting your brain and nervous system to self regulate better, and which brings so many improvements across both your physical and mental health, even in a lot that you aren't expecting. So it's been so incredible for me, I ended up actually purchasing a system and I've started my own business because I know how incredible this has been for me to heal my nervous system and brain dysregulation from the trauma I've experienced in the past and how much that's contributing to my overall health and well being to regaining my health fully. But also another wonderful thing it does is it enables the body to handle the treatments much better. So, yeah, it's it's been really powerful for me. So I've set up the Melbourne Neurofeedback Center, and I'm offering discounts, particularly to people in the Lyme community, in the cancer community. Because most of us who have gone through these types of treatments, we've spent a lot of money, we're in debt. Yet these kinds of things can have such a wonderful impact for us that my mission is just to try to make it accessible for people so they can also experience it. Oh,

Arwen Bardsley: 59:38

so how can people get in touch with you for that?

Unknown: 59:42

I've got a website called Melbourne Neurofeedback center, and my contact details are there. There's one page which has all the frequently asked questions that everything you might want to know about it. And then there's a whole section on research. You know, it's backed by decades of evidence based clinical Research in neuroscience. So there are clinical studies into all the different kinds of things that can assist with, you know, everything from ADHD, to insomnia, anxiety, depression, but also, it can be used in any situation where you want to improve your concentration or focus. So for instance, a lot of elite athletes will use it to improve their cognition, their focus, their concentration, but also to reduce their performance anxiety. So basically, anyone with a brain can benefit training their brain and helping their brain and nervous system better self regulate.

Arwen Bardsley: 1:00:39

Yeah, great. Yeah. Cuz I was just gonna say so, you know, is it still useful for people who don't have, you know, a significant problem? And you've answered that question? So thank you. That sounds like something every everyone should do. Really?

Juliet Wilson: 1:00:52

Yeah, it's definitely also used for any kind of peak performance. You know, I was thinking, I wish that I had known about it when my son was doing VCE. You know, not just for his memory and focus, but also for the anxiety around those, you know, horrendous big exams.

Arwen Bardsley: 1:01:08

Yeah. So is your business, hiring out equipment? Is that how it works?

Juliet Wilson: 1:01:14

It is, you know, I provide either after two hour sessions in my home clinic, or I do home rental systems, or I can ship them to anywhere in Australia. It's, it's a self automated system, it's plug and play. So it's very easy for anyone to use, it doesn't require diagnosis or technical expertise.

Arwen Bardsley: 1:01:33

Okay, amazing. I'll be signing up. And then, of course, the book I just want to do to let people know, I mean, I just want to say, I can't believe that you with everything you're going through, especially over the last 18 months, that that you've wrote a book as well. But I'm so glad that you did, especially for all those people out there suffering from, you know, chronic and complex illnesses that they they're having trouble, you know, resolving, and even being diagnosed and then working out how to treat themselves. So I think it's so useful. But so where can people get the book? And any other details you want to share about that?

Juliet Wilson: 1:02:15

Yeah, sure. Look, as you said, you know, my journey was horrendous, and it's unfortunately, not uncommon. You know, and I was fortunate enough to finally come across a doctor who recognized who I was dealing with. But what I realized there are so many people like me around the world who are not diagnosed properly and struggling for years, I felt it was so important to share what I learned in the hope that I could help others regain their health and survive the experience along the way. You know, it's a book that I wrote the book that I've wished that I had read 12 years ago, and I wrote it in the hope that others can recognize their own or a loved one's journey in mine. And that reading about it, you know, what I used to recover gives them the guidance and confidence that they can get well, as well. So the book is available on Amazon, you know, everywhere around the world, it's also available at readings, Carlton, and at the Sun theatre bookshop. And, yeah, I guess, you know, it's my book is dedicated to all those of you who are suffering from complex, long term illness, or who are supporting someone through it. The message I hope that people take away is that you're not alone. And there is hope. You know, I and so many others understand what you're up against. And please have compassion for yourself and know that your illness and suffering is not in your imagination. And it's not your fault. And hang in there and keep going, you know, surround yourself with a good support team and never give up. I know, you've probably tried many, many things, but please read my book and look into the protocol that I talked about. It's not the only one that will work, but it is the most comprehensive and effective that I personally came across. And the last thing is that you can and will get better and you know, I'm proof of that.

Arwen Bardsley: 1:03:57

Yeah, thank you. That's beautiful words to finish with. So I so appreciate your time, Juliet. And thank you for the wisdom and experiences that you've shared with everyone today.

Juliet Wilson: 1:04:11

My pleasure. Thank you, Arwen.